Bhakti Sandarbha 237: Guru-sevā is the Key to Success


The immediate subsequent subject after surrender is service or surrender to the Guru.



Anuccheda 237

Guru-sevā is the Key to Success


तदेवं शरणापत्तिर्विवृता। अस्याश्च पूर्वत्वं, तां विना तदीयत्वासिद्धेः।

We have thus described the path of surrender. One must first come to the point of surrender, for without it cannot attain the sense of belonging to Bhagavān.

तत्र यद्यपि शरणापत्त्यैव सर्वं सिध्यति,
शरणं तं प्रपन्ना ये ध्यानयोगविवर्जिताः।
ते वै मृत्युमतिक्रम्य यान्ति तद्वैष्णवं पदम्॥ 
(ग.पु. १.२२७.३६) इति गारुडात्,

It is true that all perfection comes simply through surrender, as stated in the Garuḍa Purāṇa:

Those who have forsaken the paths of meditation and yoga and taken refuge of You transcend death and attain the supreme abode. (GP 1.227.36)

तथापि वैशिष्ट्यलिप्सुः शक्तश्चेत् ततो भगवच्छास्त्रोपदेष्टॄणां भगवन्मन्त्रोपदेष्टॄणां वा श्रीगुरुचरणानां नित्यमेव विशेषतः सेवां कुर्यात्। तत्प्रसादो हि स्वस्वनानाप्रतीकारदुस्त्यजानर्थहानौ परमभगवत्प्रसादसिद्धौ च मूलम्।

Even so, if one longs to taste a specific flavor of love and has the ability to do so, one should constantly and single-mindedly render service to the lotus feet of a guru , who can instruct one in the confidential conclusions of scripture or who initiates one into the mystery of the mantras related to Bhagavān. Indeed, the grace of the guru is the cause of removing all insurmountable evils that cannot be overcome by any effort of one’s own, and of obtaining the supreme mercy of Bhagavān.

पूर्वत्र, यथा सप्तमे श्रीनारदवाक्यम् (भा. ७.१५.२२-२५)—

असङ्कल्पाज्जयेत् कामं क्रोधं कामविवर्जनात्।
अर्थानर्थेक्षया लोभं भयं तत्त्वावमर्शनात्॥
आन्वीक्षिक्या शोकमोहौ दम्भं महदुपासया।
योगान्तरायान् मौनेन हिंसां कामाद्यनीहया॥
कृपया भूतजं दुःखं दैवं जह्यात् समाधिना।
आत्मजं योगवीर्येण निद्रां सत्त्वनिषेवया॥
रजस्तमश्च सत्त्वेन सत्त्वं चोपशमेन च।
एतत् सर्वं गुरौ भक्त्या पुरुषो ह्यञ्जसा जयेत्॥  इति।

In the seventh canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Śrī Nārada gives an example of how one can overcome all obstacles by the mercy of one’s instructing guru:

One should conquer desire by relinquishing the spirit of enjoyment, anger by abandoning desire, greed by understanding the defects of wealth, fear by contemplating the nature of truth, lamentation and delusion by discriminating between reality and appearance, deceit by serving the wise, the obstacles of yoga through silence, violence by indifference to desire, misery arising through contact with other beings through forgiveness, misery arising from the forces of nature by experiencing samādhi, miseries connected with one’s own body and mind through the power of yoga, sleep by living according to principles of goodness, passion and ignorance through goodness, and goodness through detachment. A person can easily conquer all these by devotion to the spiritual teacher. (SB 7.15.22-25)

उत्तरत्र वामनकल्पे ब्रह्मवाक्यम्—

यो मन्त्रः स गुरुः साक्षाद्यो गुरुः स हरिः स्वयम्।
गुरुर्यस्य भवेत् तुष्टस्तस्य तुष्टो हरिः स्वयम्॥ इति।

In the Vāmana-kalpa, there is a statement by Brahmā about attaining the mercy of Bhagavān through the grace of one’s mantra-guru:

The mantra is directly the guru, and the guru is Bhagavān Hari Himself. Bhagavān Hari is personally pleased with a person with whom the guru is pleased.

अन्यत्र—
हरौ रुष्टे गुरुस्त्राता गुरौ रुष्टे न कश्चन।
तस्मात् सर्वप्रयत्नेन गुरुमेव प्रसादयेत्॥ इति।

Elsewhere it is said:

If Bhagavān Hari is displeased, one’s guru can offer protection, but if the guru is displeased, nobody can provide protection. Therefore, one should satisfy one’s guru through all one’s endeavors.

अत एव सेवामात्रं तु नित्यमेव। यथा चान्यत्र परमेश्वरवाक्यम्—

प्रथमं तु गुरुः पूज्यः ततश्चैव ममार्चनम्।
कुर्वन् सिद्धिमवाप्नोति ह्यन्यथा निष्फलं भवेत्॥ इति।

Therefore serving one’s guru is a regular duty, as stated by Bhagavān in the following text:

One should worship Me only after first worshiping one’s guru. By doing so, one attains perfection, otherwise one’s efforts end in futility.

अत एव नारदपञ्चरात्रे—
वैष्णवं ज्ञानवक्तारं यो विद्याद्विष्णुवद्गुरुम्।
पूजयेद्वाङ्मनःकायैः स शास्त्रज्ञः स वैष्णवः॥
श्लोकपादस्य वक्तापि यः पूज्यः स सदैव हि।
किं पुनर्भगवद्विष्णोः स्वरूपं वितनोति यः॥ इत्यादि।

Thus it is said in the Nārada-Pañcarātra:

One who accepts a Vaiṣṇava guru, who imparts transcendental knowledge, on the same level as Viṣṇu, and who worships him with body, mind and speech, understands the conclusions of scripture and is a Vaiṣṇava. One who explains even a quarter of a verse is certainly always worshipable, so what to speak of a guru who reveals the identity of Bhagavān Viṣṇu!

पाद्मे देवद्युतिस्तुतौ—
भक्तिर्यथा हरौ मेऽस्ति तद्वरिष्ठा गुरौ यदि।
ममास्ति तेन सत्येन स्वं दर्शयतु मे हरिः॥ इति।

In the prayers of Devadyuti from the Padma Purāṇa, we find this statement:

If my devotion to my guru surpasses my devotion to Bhagavān Hari, then by the strength of this fact, let Bhagavān Hari appear before me.

तस्मादन्यद्भगवद्भजनमपि नापेक्षते। यथोक्तमागमे पुरश्चरणफलप्रसङ्गे—

यथा सिद्धरसस्पर्शात् ताम्रं भवति काञ्चनम्।
सन्निधानाद्गुरोरेवं शिष्यो विष्णुमयो भवेत्॥ इति।

Consequently, for a person devoted to the guru in this manner, there is no need of executing any other limb of devotion, as stated in the Āgama scripture in the section describing the results of the puraścaraṇa ceremony:

Just as by contact with processed mercury, copper turns into gold, a disciple is awakened to Viṣṇu's divine nature by association with his guru.

तदेतदाह (भा. १०.८०.३४)—
नाहमिज्याप्रजातिभ्यां तपसोपशमेन वा।
तुष्येयं सर्वभूतात्मा गुरुशुश्रूषया यथा॥

In his discussion with Śrīdāma, Bhagavān Kṛṣṇa confirmed the same point that other limbs of devotion are unnecessary for one devoted to his guru:
I, the Supreme Self within all living beings, am not as pleased by sacrifices, nor by superior birth, nor by penances, nor by tranquility of mind, as I am with the service rendered by a disciple to his teacher. (SB 10.80.34)

टीका च — "ज्ञानप्रदाद्गुरोरधिकः सेव्यो नास्तीत्युक्तम्। अत एव तद्भजनादधिको धर्मश्च नास्तीत्याह—नाहमिति। इज्या गृहस्थधर्मः। प्रजातिः प्रकृष्टं जन्म उपनयनं, तेन ब्रह्मचारिधर्म उपलक्ष्यते, ताभ्याम्। तथा तपसा वनस्थधर्मेण। उपशमेन यतिधर्मेण वा। अहं परमेश्वरस्तथा न तुष्येयं, यथा सर्वभूतात्मापि गुरुशुश्रूषया॥" इत्येषा।

Śrīdhara Svāmī comments: “There is no one more worthy of service than a guru who bestows transcendental knowledge. This was stated already. Therefore, there is no higher duty than rendering service to him. The present verse is spoken to elucidate this point. The word ijyā, or Vedic sacrifice, refers to the duties of a householder. Superior birth (prajātiḥ) refers to the birth in which one is initiated into the study of the Vedas by acceptance of the sacred thread. This is a reference to the duties of a student. 'By penance’ (tapasā) refers to the duties of one who has retired to the forest, and 'by tranquility of mind' (upaśamena) refers to the duties of a renunciant. Bhagavān declares that although He is situated as the Supreme Self within all living beings, He is not as satisfied by all these practices as by service rendered to one’s teacher.”

अत्र ज्ञानं ब्रह्मनिष्ठं भगवन्निष्ठं चेति द्विविधम्। तत्र पूर्वत्र तथैव व्याख्या। उत्तरत्र त्वेवम्—इज्या पूजा। प्रजातिर्वैष्णवदीक्षा। तपः समाधिः। उपशमो भगवन्निष्ठेति॥

The knowledge bestowed by the guru, as referred to in Śrīdhara Svāmī’s commentary, can be of two types—that which relates to Brahman or that which relates to Bhagavān. In the case where knowledge relates to Brahman, the explanation of the words in this verse is as given above. In the second case, however, the words should be understood as follows: ijyā would refer to worship of Bhagavān, prajāti to initiation into the Viṣṇu mantra, tapaḥ to samādhi and upaśama to the state of fixity in Bhagavān.

॥१०.८०॥ श्रीभगवान् श्रीदामविप्रम्॥२३७॥



Commentary by Satyanarayana Dasa Babaji Maharaj

In this anuccheda Śrī Jīva Gosvāmī reveals the secret formula for success. That is service to guru from one’s heart without any deceptive mentality, not desiring anything in return. This formula is true for all paths but specifically so for bhakti and compulsory for rāgānugā bhakti. Millions of people take to spiritual practice but hardly one gets the proclaimed and desired goal. The reason lies in not using this secret formula. If one logically analyzes the spiritualists one may conclude that it is all a claim without any truth behind in it. It is like if a farmer who plants one million mango trees and only one tree yields any fruit. One would not call that successful farming, and one would seriously doubt repeating the process or recommending it to others. However, instead of thinking that something is wrong with the mango plants, one should seriously consider his farming methodology. Similarly, instead of thinking that spirituality is bogus, one should seriously think that the practitioners are doing something wrong. One cannot expect proper result by acting improperly. Proper action cannot be done without proper knowledge. Proper knowledge comes from a proper guru by studying properly. This is the missing link in the chain of success to bhakti.

Śrī Jīva Gosvāmī says that service to guru is so potent that one can get all perfection simply by that alone, even if one is not executing the other forms of bhakti. Earlier it was said that in bhakti the success can come merely by cultivating one of its limbs or by a combination of few of them. But among all these limbs, service to guru is not optional.

Whatever one does, this must be included with that. In Hari-bhakti-vilāsa it is said,


guru-mūlam idaṁ sarvaṁ tasmān nityaṁ guruṁ bhajet 

puraścaraṇa-hīno’pi mantrī siddhyen na saṁśayaḥ


All this [perfection in the mantra] is rooted in guru, therefore, one must serve guru regularly. By guru-sevā one can attain such perfection even without going through the practice called puraścaraṇa. There is no doubt about this. (HBV 17.242)

The reason for the importance of having a guru was explained in the previous anuccheda. Here the importance of service to guru has been highlighted. In Vāmana-kalpa it is said that if Bhagavān becomes upset with someone then the guru can give protection, but if the guru is upset even Bhagavān cannot help because He himself has given this power to the guru. He does not want that an aspiring spiritualist should bypass the guru and approach Him directly. First one has prove himself or herself to the guru. Guru is the testing ground. It is like before an actor goes on the stage, he or she has to rehearse offstage. Similarly before one is allowed to enter into Kṛṣṇa’s play one has to rehearse with guru. Once the guru is satisfied then one has attained the visa to enter into the kingdom of Bhagavān. Guru is thus like an ambassador from Bhagavān’s kingdom. Therefore, in Indian scriptures so much stress has been given on the principle of guru-sevā

Mahābhārata (Ādi-parva, third chapter) begins with the stories of four students, Āruṇi, Upamanyu, Veda, and Uttaṅka and their service to their gurus. These stories throw light on the prevalent culture of guru-bhakti in the olden times which can still be witnessed, although it has become very rare. Even Kṛṣṇa, who is called jagad-guru, the universal teacher, went and lived in the ashram of Sandipani Muni and did service to him. This was done to set an example for us.

Yet, for all that, there are many teachers who say that we do not need a guru, or that we are our own guru. This is like saying, “ I have no tongue in my mouth.” If that is true, how can I speak? If the guru is not required then why are they even teaching this and thus contradicting their own statement, because if we accept their words then they become our guru. If we do not accept, then we should take a guru. In either case, guru is unavoidable.

According to Nārada-pañcarātra one should respect every teacher from whom one has learnt something, not just the dīkṣā-guru. In this regard Cāṇakya writes:


ekākṣara-pradātāraṁ yo guruṁ nābhivandate

śvāna-yoni-śataṁ gatvā cāṇḍāleñv abhijāyate


One who does not respect a guru from whom one has learnt even one word will take birth as a dog for one hundred births and then as a cāṇḍāla, an outcaste. (Cāṇakya-nīti 13.18)


Bhakti Sandarbha 236 : Sharanagati or Surrender
Bhakti Sandarbha 235 : Vaidhī Nirguṇā Bhakti
Bhakti Sandarbha 234 : Svarūpa-siddhā Niṣkāmā Bhakti
Bhakti Sandarbha 231-233 : Svarūpa-siddhā Bhakti and the Three Gunas
Bhakti Sandarbha 228-230: Mixed Bhakti desiring only pure bhakti
Bhakti Sandarbha 226-227 : Kaivalya-kāmā Bhakti mixed with karma and jnana
Bhakti Sandarbha 225 : Three Divisions of Saṅga-siddhā Bhakti
Bhakti Sandarbha 224 : Three Motives Behind the Offering of Karma
Bhakti Sandarbha 222-223: The Result Of Karma is Under the Control of Bhagavān
Bhakti Sandarbha 218-221: Karma Offered To Bhagavān Destroys Karma


Comments

Parikshit said…
Guru, in the traditional sense of the word, isn't a necessity as has been maintained by many bhakti saints; of which Ramsukhdas Maharaja is a contemporary example -- he warned against middlemanship and advocated for a direct relationship between Bhagavan and devotee. There is no contradiction in modern teachers teaching that guru is not mandatory because the modern usage of the term 'guru' differs from the traditional sense. The traditional connotation of accepting a guru is a virtual surrender of everything one possesses in service of guru. In this sense, I see no reason why a sufficiently intelligent person would do such a primitive act unless one has been brainwashed into believing that accepting a guru is necessary.

Man's desire to know and love Bhagavan supersedes everything else. Guruship had been an ancient compulsion, Internet (which should be seen as a manifestation of Bhagavan) has changed the equation. Middlemanship is a myth now.

Though I disagree with Babaji Satyanarayan das on this point, I find his commentaries and penetrating analysis unparalleled for which I have great respect for him. I see him as one of my gurus, but certainly not in the traditional sense. Why? Because that is not needed in modern times.

Anonymous said…
Two points to make, maybe, Parikshitji.

1) with this line of thinking you're not only disagreeing with Satyanarayan Das Maharaja, but with all smriti and shastra. "But we got the Web now!" seems like a pretty flimsy ground for rejecting thousands of years of tradition, experience, practice, consideration and (let's go out on a limb here) Actual Divine Grace. Not saying that you can't or shouldn't hold this view, but one might wonder if one can rightly claim to love Bhagavan if one is so casually rejecting Bhagavan's recorded and transmitted Feelings On This Matter.

2) As for transmission: it would seem to me the equation intelligence + info does not = prema (or mukti, for that matter). Yes, the Guru tells you stuff you might also get elsewhere, but he also Tells You Stuff. And there ain't no substituting that even through so excellent a blog as Jagat-ji's.
Parikshit said…
Dear Anonymous Ji, I have this to say in response:

Your first allegation is that I'm disagreeing with "all smrti and sastra". I'm not disagreeing with "all" smrti and sastra. Smrti and sastra is a broad cannon of diverse philosophies, theologies, and realizations. The topic of 'guru' is a small constituent of this vast cannon. So, saying that I'm disagreeing with all "smrti and sastra" is incorrect. Yoga Sutras of Patanjali, for instance, are a valid means of knowledge and what they maintain is "Isvara-pranidhana" not "Guru-pranidhana". If guru was a necessasity Patanjali would have made that clear as he does with 'yamas' and 'niyamas'. Since Patanjali uses 'Isvara Pranidhana", the Yoga Sutras cannot be categorized as non-bhakti literature. They cater to the desires of both the theists and the atheists.

The second allegation is that I'm rejecting years of practice and experience. I'm not rejecting the practice, abhyasa is mandatory for any experience to manifest. Experience is an individual affair drenched in subjectivity. Your experience may help me through reading your books and listening to your words. From where does the peculiarity of 'surrender' steeps in?

You use the phrase 'Actual Divine Grace'? Please explain its mechanics, I don't understand what you mean by that.

Your next allegation is that I'm rejecting Bhagavan's recorded and transitted 'Feelings'. Where does Bhagavan mandate a guru, as is held traditionally that you virtually surrender everything to the guru? Krishna says in the Gita that: 'to know' approach a guru, serve, and inquire. Did he say 'surrender all your being to the guru' -- which is what the traditional gurus have been propagating?

I couldn't understand your last point. Too little 'stuff' to make sense to me.
Anonymous said…

The fact you are here Parikshit is at it should be.

And by that very fact, one need not ask the obvious question; the reason why you are here Parikshit?

Because the answer is equally obvious; you are without the command of Guru (prīmā faciē - the word “command” is not a superficial term, the profound expression of this word is far beyond the minds of the un-awakened).

Absolute stillness of mind attains Liberation. This being so, please tell how one may yoke their mind to those unobtainable proofs (you speak of) without mental efforts; or drown in the Bliss of Liberation without the feet of the Divine Grace of the Guru?

You have found on this blog one of the few oasis of truth Parikshit, but even this oasis is no substitute for the Command of the Guru.

In truth, think of those who write here as your own self, come to remind you of what you already know.
Anonymous said…
Bhakti is relational. So, let's try an analogy.

Bhagavan has a large and varied retinue of associates, just as you have a wide circle of friends and loved ones.

If someone approaches you, seeking to become your friend, you may wonder, "Does this person already know and like any of my other friends?" When you meet the friend of your friend, this person is much more likely to become your friend. Certainly if your prospective new friend came to you and said, "I don't give a damn about your many other friends; I want to be your friend alone," you would be LESS likely to accept such a friendship. Rather, if you meet a new friend, you will want to share that new friend with all your other friends.

It is the same with Bhagavan or with a genuine guru. The guru who says "You must be my friend alone" is likely to be a charlatan and a cheater, and you should run away. Rather, the genuine guru wants you to love his loved ones even though the guru will remain paramount in your heart.

Don't worry about this too much, though. The genuine guru wants this attitude to come genuinely from your own heart. The guru who demands submission will naturally turn you off and cause you to look elsewhere. YOUR guru, on the other hand, will be the one to whom you cannot but submit, out of love rather than intimidation.

Parikshit said…
Dear Anonymous Ji,

First of all, I don't think you addressed what I suggested. You have begun a fresh discussion without first finishing the previous. My response to the comment follows:


You say: "Absolute stillness of mind attains Liberation. This being so, please tell how one may yoke their mind to those unobtainable proofs (you speak of) without mental efforts; or drown in the Bliss of Liberation without the feet of the Divine Grace of the Guru?"

Without effort, without employing buddhi; clearly, liberation cannot be achieved. How to yoke the mind is what the subject matter of the Yoga Sutras is. By practising what Patanjali has recommended the mind is to be stilled. Patanjali didn't say that one cannot achieve the ultimate state of samadhi without a guru.

You say: "This oasis is no substitute for the Command of the Guru."

That is a statement. Please Substantiate it to add credibility. If that is your personal opinion, then that should have been stated.

You say: "What you already know."

That is false as per shastra. The jiva is in a state of beginningless ignorance.

I liked the analogy and what you said about a genuine guru. Nevertheless, I don't buy that one cannot attain the highest state of awareness without a guru -- this has been the verdict of many saints from diverse Vedantic backgrounds. There are others as well, like you, who necessitate the guru -- but here we have a difference of opinion and this is what this discussion has been all about, i.e, to make arguments regarding what view is more reasonable.

I'm yet to listen to a reasonably strong argument from your side as to the necessity of the guru, as has been traditionally connotated by the term 'guru' -- which is, a complete surrender.





ज्ञात said…
Parikshit said: “I'm yet to listen to a reasonably strong argument from your side”

Let go of “reason”, “argument” and especially “sides;” perhaps you will even find your Guru if you begin by listening more intently to yourself.

Yes, “the state of not knowing (directly perceiving) the eternal source of all life” is the same as your quote “The jiva is in a state of beginningless ignorance.”

Please humour an old man by answering a question:

“What the word Guru mean?”

Notes

The English word Ignorance is from the Latin in- ‎(“un-”‎) +‎ gnārus ‎(“knowing”‎). In turn, the Latin word gnārus is from the Proto-Indo-European root ǵneh₃ (perfective) ‎“to know,” which cognates with the Ancient Greek word γνῶσῐς (gnôsis) and Sanskrit ज्ञात (jñātá) “known, perceived.”

Beginningless - that which is “without beginning is eternal.”
Anonymous said…

Parikshit, if you do decide to answer the question “What does the word Guru mean?” Please do not turn your answer into a literary exercise of convenient cut-and-paste quotes from the experiences of others, but answer simply and in own words describing your own experience.
Parikshit said…
Dear Anonymous Ji,

So now I know that you are a man and an old one. I assume you have more maturity than me taking cognizance of our significant age difference. By maturity, I mean spiritual experience and understanding of life. Probably you don't bother about framing your arguments properly, that is okay, but in my opinion, one should be clear in written communication and avoid vague terms as the readers are not aware of the writer's mood and experience. You are yet to address my observations in previous comments. Discussions should not be "hit and run" exercises.

Letting go of "reason", "argument", "sides" is an apparent invitation to becoming a fanatic. You seem to have a negative meaning of these terms in your mind, otherwise, you would not suggest letting go of them.

You have asked me to state what I mean by the term Guru. I already did that in a previous discussion. Whatever takes one closer to Truth is Guru. It could be a tree, the Internet, an old man, etc. I reject the traditional acceptance of the term Guru which to me appears "blind following" originating from either fear or an unreasonable belief in traditions that propagate indispensability of guru.

My experience is that "citta vrtti nirodha" is the most accurate expression of yoga. And for that one needs resolve and practice.

You say: "Please do not turn your answer into a literary exercise of convenient cut-and-paste quotes from the experiences of others, but answer simply and in own words describing your own experience."

Substantiate your claims. You seem to be suggesting that I'm cutting and pasting. You do not seem to be interested in adding credibility to what you say. That is why I ask for evidence, fanatics would hate that.

Correction: "Beginningless" does not mean "that which is without beginning is eternal". Beginningless simply means "that which is without a beginning". It is not an "eternal" state. Otherwise, ignorance can never end. You seem to be "copy-pasting" from substandard sources.




One remembers once watching a dog feverously chasing its own tail in circles; and in-turn this memory springs again to mind whilst reading your literary acrobatics.

Stop chasing your own tail Parkishit and find your Guru; there is no substitute for true experience, and in truth there is no true experience without the command from the mouth of your Guru.

How will you know your true Guru Parkishit?

By the way he smiles (-:
Anonymous said…

To have an end there must be a beginning (one cannot end what has not yet begun), if one has no beginning, then there can be no end, and of course that which is without beginning or end is eternal…
Parikshit said…
Dear Anonymous Ji,

It seems to digress from what is being discussed is what you like. You got the meaning of 'beginningless' wrong. Here is what it means:

You say: "To have an end there must be a beginning (one cannot end what has not yet begun)..."


You have misunderstood the meaning of the term "beginningless". The jiva, Bhagavan, and all potencies of Bhagavan never had a beginning -- this is what beginningless means. Similarly, the ignorance of the jiva is without a beginning -- the jiva has always been in ignorance of Bhagavan. And who told you that a beginningless state cannot have an end; seemingly it is your own misunderstanding. Beginningless state of ignorance can end through yoga. Probably you didn't bother to closely read shastra, to whose validity you have been loudspeaking in a previous comment. Quite surprising. Doesn't the Guru's 'gaze' help one rationally?!

You say: "and of course that which is without beginning or end is eternal…"

Again, incorrect understanding. Ignorance is beginningless and yet is potentially noneternal.

I know it could be difficult to accept mistakes, especially for the male ego. But I don't think you would have difficulties since you seemingly claim to have received the 'Guru's gaze'! Anonymity is a fanatic's guard.

Parikshit said…
Surely, brahmacharya is essential for any prolonged concentration, whether for material or spiritual accomplishment. Also, whoever is a fanatic regarding celibacy cannot be a brahmachari since a fanatic's mind is occupied with semen retention; and this is why he must ejaculate. Realizing the sexual vrtti inside out automatically ceases its allure.
Anonymous said…

The more you try to “frame your arguments properly,” the quicker they will slip through one’s open fingers; dust, all dust Parikshit, let go of yourself and find your Guru.
Anonymous said…
Sigh…You think there is only one answer, your answer… Open your mind Parikshit, go and look up ‘and study’ the word जीव jīvá (page 422 of Monier-Williams).

Now frame the word jīvá in the context of the word “eternal;” better still, go and find the original Sanskrit of your quote “the jiva is in a state of beginningless ignorance” and re-translate all the Sanskrit yourself (in your own words).

When you have realised the truth, apologise to yourself !

Notes

Dhātu: जीव् (jīv)

Dhātupāṭha: प्राणधारण (prāṇa-dhāraṇa)
Anonymous said…

N.B.* Dearest, if you do decide to translate this verse (for oneself), do not get caught out by superficial translations presented by Sanskrit compound words, break each compound word up and re-translate every part (no stone unturned).
Anonymous said…

Do not waste time with the exoteric, one must break up the compounds and look deeper within to find the esoteric.
Parikshit said…
Dear Anonymous Ji,

You say: "The more you try to “frame your arguments properly,” the quicker they will slip through one’s open fingers; dust, all dust Parikshit, let go of yourself and find your Guru."

It is rather the opposite. The better one understands, the clearer reality gets. Only a man of hazy understanding would say what you are saying. What you seem to suggest is turning off the discriminatory ability of buddhi. One hopes you may see the redundancy of what you say.

Translating for oneself is good. However, that requires a good understanding of how Sanskrit functions, Panini's rules on grammar should be known. One can keep deciphering whimsically and fantasize about "discovering the truth". One fails to see that an author employs words keeping a particular meaning in mind -- though you may reinterpret the writings, you probably would get a meaning not intended by the author. I wonder how much Patanjali you would have understood had you not consulted previous translations and commentaries.

Also, the beginningless state of jiva's ignorance is a fundamental truth which doesn't change no matter how you translate. You may express this truth differently, but the concept remains the same. Many Western scholars on Sanskrit do what you are suggesting: relying on one's own understanding alone and translating Sanskrit works without the cultural-traditional lens through which the work is to be seen. The result is a poor incorrect translation. Broaden your understanding by reading or listening to Rajiv Malhotra.


One did not think you would exercise the choice to find the source of your quote and translate the very few words of Sanskrit yourself; predictably, you chose to write many more words in order to yet again “frame your argument,” a great shame (we could have both learned something new).

Do not rely on the second-hand experiences of others; yes, the internet is a marvellous tool, but it is no substitute for one’s own true Guru Parikshit.
Anonymous said…

It is healthier to end this spinning conversation; in the love of truth, possessing infinite patience, one hopes you will (by your own free will) become liberated from all suffering, and wishes only good for you Parikshit.


Parikshit said…
You are surely a word juggler.

Parikshit said: "You are surely a word juggler."

Juggler, from Old-English ġeogolere, which (in turn) is from Norse kuklari, which originates from Old Norse Kuk (kokkr) “(vulgar) a phallus, a cock” + -lari (læra) “to teach” (teach – “to show, point out”).

“A phallus ([of energy that] points out [above the skull]) to teach.”
Anonymous said…

The Western House

The House in this descent (of the teaching into the world). It is the Western Face, the best (of all).

Verse 8, Chapter 7, Manthānabhairavatantram Kumārikārikākhaṇḍaḥ (translated to English by Mark Dyczkowski).

Notes

The Western House (also called the House of the Yogini) is located at the end of the twelve above the head from which the teaching and the lineage of teachers proceed. The Western face is the Liṅga of the goddess (śrīliṅga), which, situated at the End of the Twelve, drips the nectar of the consecrating Command.

The Current Teachers (gurvogha), called (the Convention of) the Flower extends from the Transmental up to Ādinātha (the First Nātha).

Verse 64, Chapter 7, Manthānabhairavatantram Kumārikārikākhaṇḍaḥ (translated to English by Mark Dyczkowski).

Notes

Gurvogha

गुर्व् (gurv) See 2. ( = √ gur ), gūrvati, “to raise, lift up”:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=360.gif


ओघ (ogha) ( √ vah ) “flood, stream, rapid flow of water; heap, abundance; uninterrupted tradition, instruction”:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=235.gif

Nātha, “a swelling bud (which) project(s) (out of the top of the skull),” see:

http://jagadanandadas.blogspot.com/2006/07/some-more-autobiographical-notes-this.html?showComment=1559572364650#c7353567992604200346
Anonymous said…

“Just as no crop grows in a field devoid of seed, so too there is no liberation for those devoid of the Convention of the Flower (puṣpasaṁketaka)”

Verses 66cd and 67ab, Chapter 7, Manthānabhairavatantram Kumārikārikākhaṇḍaḥ (translated to English by Mark Dyczkowski).

Notes

पुष्पस (puṣpasa) “the lungs”:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=640.gif

केत (kéta) “desire, will, house, shape, mark, sign.” See √ चित् (cít) 1. “piling up; forming a layer or stratum, piled (up),” and also 4. & 5:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=308.gif

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=394.gif

क (ká) See 3. “sun, light, water, head, sound etc.” & 4. “like a horse”:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=240.gif

Convention “coming together”:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/convention
Anonymous said…

See also:

पुष्पस (puṣpasa) → पुष् (puṣ) + प (pa) + स (sa)

पुष् (puṣ) See Push 1, 2 & 3:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=638.gif

प (pa) See 2, 3 & 5:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=573.gif

स (sa) See 4, 5 & 7:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1111.gif
Anonymous said…

See pages 73 & 74 of Mount Kaumāra – Śrīśaila:

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n193

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n195

Notes

श्रि (śri) See 1 & 3:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1098.gif

शैल (śaila):

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1089.gif
Anonymous said…
Page 75 (and onwards) also makes interesting reading Jagadananda Das:

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n195

Especially page 122 (beginning with “Kṛṣṇa declares”):

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n993

And page 225 (beginning with “Just as Kṛṣṇa emanates Rādhā”):

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n1095

See also page 17 of Chapter 7 (beginning with “This secret gospel of the Gītā”):

https://archive.org/details/ManthanBhairavaKumarikaKhandMarkDyczkowski/page/n1483

N.B.* Use the zoom function (located on the right-hand side of the navigation menu) to read the text.
Anonymous said…

Sincere apology Jagadananda Das, this translation of the word पुष्पस (puṣpasa) is more consistent with the instruction being conveyed (by the text in the comment dated Sunday, 27 October, 2019); please see:

पुष्प (púṣpa) "a flower blossom, the menstrual flux, blooming, expanding, of a mountain":

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=639.gif

स (sa) see 2, 3 (N.B.* ṣaḍ-ja Page 1109, Column 2), 4, 5 * 7:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1111.gif

ṣaḍ-ja (Shaḍ-ja):

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1109.gif

Notes

Anapaest, from Ancient Greek ἀναπαίω ‎(anapaíō) to "strike again", ἀνα- ‎(ana-, “again; backwards”‎) +‎ παίω ‎(paíō, “I strike, hit”‎).

Again, think of the repeated Energetic stroke produced by the rise and fall of sakti energy here Jagadananda Das.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E1%BC%80%CE%BD%CE%B1%CF%80%CE%B1%CE%AF%CF%89#Ancient_Greek
Anonymous said…

Again, the reader should bear in mind that the English word ‘mountain’ must be read not in the current lingua-franca, but in the understanding of a more ancient tongue (which directly bridges across from English to Sanskrit):

English 'Mountain' from the Proto-Indo-European root word men- (“to project, stick out”).

Source:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/mountain

See also:

http://jagadanandadas.blogspot.com/2006/07/some-more-autobiographical-notes-this.html?showComment=1559572364650#c7353567992604200346
Anonymous said…

See “Vedhamayī Dīkṣā: Initiation by Penetration” (page 312 onwards) of “The Alchemical Body: Siddha Traditions in Medieval India” by David Gordon White.

ISBN-13: 978-0226894997 or ISBN-10: 0226894991
Juggler said…

bhāvakāli vecite āmi āilāṅa kāśīpure
grāhaka nāhi, nā vikāya, lañā yāba ghare

“I came to Kashipur to sell my jugglery, but there are no customers available here, So I will take it back to my home.” (Cc. Madhya 17.144)

Source (Page 3, Issue No. 418 Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu Magazine):

https://archive.org/details/bindu418/page/n1

N.B.* Click the Zoom function to read.

Dear Jagadananda Das,

If one has followed along (by reading all the comment’s above) and also clicked the link to read page 3 (and hopefully the rest) of the Sri Krishna Kathamrita Bindu Magazine.

The true jugglery being spoken of is the jugglery of śákti or śaktí (energy); see:

http://www.sanskrita.org/scans/visor.html?scan=1044.gif

N.B.* There are “many” forms of śaktí energy that the skilled juggler may raise up (amongst these many forms of śaktí [in regard to Vedhamayī Dīkṣā] may be found the spear, lance, pike or dart)
Anonymous said…

gagana maṇḍala mãĩ ūndhā kūbā, tahā͂ ãmṛta kā bāsā, sagurā hoi su bhari bhari pīvai, nigurā jāi piyāsā. (23)

There is an upside down well in the inner firmament, That is the source of ambrosia. You have a sadguru, so drink deeply of it. With no guru, you will go thirsty. (23)

Gorakh Sabadi: The Sayings of Gorakh
Edited and translated by Yogi Surajnath, Guru Budhnath ji, and Bhagavan Nath.
Anonymous said…

Why You Need a Guru (Ādyaśakti Svāmī):

https://youtu.be/OuXb91bbVhs

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